Winstep

Software Technologies


 Winstep Forums


Print view
Board index : Winstep Forums : General Discussion  [ 40 posts ] Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3
Author Message
 Post subject: Re: New Icon Row order for Shelves at the top of the screen
PostPosted: Fri Sep 14, 2018 7:00 am 
Offline
Site Admin
User avatar

Joined: Thu Feb 26, 2004 8:30 pm
Posts: 9407
seeker wrote:
1. Shelf docked at top, normal
2. Shelf docked at top, inverted
3. Shelf floating, normal
4. Shelf floating, inverted
5. Shelf docked at bottom, normal
6. Shelf docked at bottom, inverted

1,2 and 4


Thank you, kind sir. :D

You really think that docked at the top NOT inverted feels wrong?!

So, basically, you think the content of the body of the Shelf should always be the same (icon row 1 ALWAYS at the top), regardless of where the tabs are.

In other words, if you fully expand a multi-row, not inverted, Shelf at the top of the screen by double clicking a tab header, row 1 would ALWAYS remain static at the top.

_________________
Jorge Coelho
Winstep Xtreme - Xtreme Power!
http://www.winstep.net - Winstep Software Technologies


Back to top
 Profile WWW 
 
 Post subject: Re: New Icon Row order for Shelves at the top of the screen
PostPosted: Fri Sep 14, 2018 7:03 am 
Offline

Joined: Tue Mar 01, 2016 11:46 am
Posts: 332
to me yes, i think of it as reading a book, row 2 should be bellow row 1


Back to top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Icon Row order for Shelves at the top of the screen
PostPosted: Fri Sep 14, 2018 12:58 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sat Apr 07, 2018 7:19 pm
Posts: 463
Location: UK
seeker wrote:
to me yes, i think of it as reading a book, row 2 should be bellow row 1

And therein lies your error, to my my way of thinking. You all see it as something else and approach the whole thing emotionally (i.e., as to how it *feels*) instead of rationally, logically. The shelf *isn't* a book or whatever, it's a totally different paradigm. And therefore it functions in a very different way, logically in accordance with its nature. The way top edge shelves behave now is entirely consistent with their nature of being a mirror image of a bottom shelf, much as a right edge shelf is a mirror image of a left shelf. and a horizontal free-floating shelf is and behaves just like a bottom shelf, precisely because that is what it is.

Sure, one or two things with the new, correct way *seemed* a little strange to me too for a few minutes, but then thinking about Jorge's reasoning and the nature of the shelf in a calm, rational manner, I quickly realised how *right* this was and that I'd been led astray by my feelings. Fortunately, not having used top edge shelves much in the past (although I generally used to use a free-floating one in my personal setup) I did not suffer from 'muscle memory' and so adjustment for me was instantaneous.

Please, all of you who think that the new and correct way *feels* 'wrong', try and look at it with fresh eyes and a fresh, open mind, in a purely rational, logical way. If you do, you will soon see the error of your 'feeling'.

It is what it is. A shelf. And sometimes a shelf is just a shelf, not a cigar. ;)

_________________
nexter - so, what's next?


Back to top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Icon Row order for Shelves at the top of the screen
PostPosted: Sat Sep 15, 2018 6:17 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Mar 18, 2004 12:11 am
Posts: 327
Location: Pollock Pines, CA
This:
seeker wrote:
Code:
IJ
ABCDEFGH

_________________
vectornut
http://www.vectornut.com


Back to top
 Profile WWW 
 
 Post subject: Re: New Icon Row order for Shelves at the top of the screen
PostPosted: Sat Sep 15, 2018 6:51 am 
Offline
Site Admin
User avatar

Joined: Thu Feb 26, 2004 8:30 pm
Posts: 9407
vectornut wrote:
This:
seeker wrote:
Code:
IJ
ABCDEFGH


This what, Paul? Feels wrong? Feels right?

_________________
Jorge Coelho
Winstep Xtreme - Xtreme Power!
http://www.winstep.net - Winstep Software Technologies


Back to top
 Profile WWW 
 
 Post subject: Re: New Icon Row order for Shelves at the top of the screen
PostPosted: Sun Sep 16, 2018 1:04 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Mar 18, 2004 12:11 am
Posts: 327
Location: Pollock Pines, CA
winstep wrote:
vectornut wrote:
This:
seeker wrote:
Code:
IJ
ABCDEFGH


This what, Paul? Feels wrong? Feels right?


Is the correct way. Speaking as a mechanical engineer. ;-)

_________________
vectornut
http://www.vectornut.com


Back to top
 Profile WWW 
 
 Post subject: Re: New Icon Row order for Shelves at the top of the screen
PostPosted: Mon Sep 17, 2018 9:45 pm 
Offline
Site Admin
User avatar

Joined: Thu Feb 26, 2004 8:30 pm
Posts: 9407
vectornut wrote:
Is the correct way. Speaking as a mechanical engineer. ;-)


LOL. I told you guys this was a question of preference and getting used to it. Some like it hot, some like it cold. :wink:

_________________
Jorge Coelho
Winstep Xtreme - Xtreme Power!
http://www.winstep.net - Winstep Software Technologies


Back to top
 Profile WWW 
 
 Post subject: Re: New Icon Row order for Shelves at the top of the screen
PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2018 1:05 pm 
Offline

Joined: Wed Aug 05, 2009 3:47 pm
Posts: 638
First, the one thing I must reiterate (something I was going to do a little earlier but decided to leave it alone) is that the reason I prefer the icons to be top left to right has absolutely nothing to do with me using it that way in the Shelf for a long time. It has to do with the fact that I'm an English speaker/reader/writer and every other program and book I've used operates in that manner.

I would have immediately posted in this forum to find out how to change it if the current version were the first time I used Xtreme (or the other Winstep products).

The only conclusion one can arrive at to take care of this issue so everyone is happy (except maybe Jorge because it might be a lot of extra work :lol: ) is to make the option for the user to arrange the icons in any order they want, or at least, as I've said before, be able to arrange the icons in ascending or descending order, top left to right, and how it is with the current version while docked at the top.

Doing that is what Winstep products are all about! Customization! :)


Back to top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Icon Row order for Shelves at the top of the screen
PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2018 2:32 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sat Apr 07, 2018 7:19 pm
Posts: 463
Location: UK
Windy wrote:
First, the one thing I must reiterate (something I was going to do a little earlier but decided to leave it alone) is that the reason I prefer the icons to be top left to right has absolutely nothing to do with me using it that way in the Shelf for a long time. It has to do with the fact that I'm an English speaker/reader/writer and every other program and book I've used operates in that manner.

I would have immediately posted in this forum to find out how to change it if the current version were the first time I used Xtreme (or the other Winstep products).

The only conclusion one can arrive at to take care of this issue so everyone is happy (except maybe Jorge because it might be a lot of extra work :lol: ) is to make the option for the user to arrange the icons in any order they want, or at least, as I've said before, be able to arrange the icons in ascending or descending order, top left to right, and how it is with the current version while docked at the top.

Doing that is what Winstep products are all about! Customization! :)

As has been pointed out before, the shelf is clearly *not* every other or any other programme - it functions in a completely different way, it is a vastly different paradigm to anything else out there.

As has also been pointed out before (countless times, yawn), your preference *is* purely a matter of having been used to a certain way and is purely a preference, nothing else. In no way does it affect function. I am an English speaker/reader/writer, and the way the shelf functions now in re: of icon row arrangements is the only logical and logically consistent way. Whether Americans (I go by your spellings here) speak English is, BTW, highly debatable generally. ;) Either way, being an English speaker or otherwise has absolutely nothing to do with this issue.

The shelf is a shelf, not a book or any other programme. This cigar really is just a cigar. Not a mobility scooter. ;) It is unique. (And no, not absolutely unique - 'unique' either is or is not, it cannot be qualified. :P ) Smoke it, enjoy it for what it is. :)

Look, I came across an 'issue' with a scroll bar that wasn't actually a scroll bar but functioned like one, scrolling in effect the 'wrong' way round, elsewhere in Xtreme. Pointing it out, Jorge realised the issue and pointed out why this was so etc. For me, it was a very minor detail normally out of sight and rarely used, but still, clearly not as it should have been. Did I go on about it and make a fuss? Hell no, I just accepted it for what it was and let it be. Not important.

Your constant reiteration of what is no more than your preference, and a very unimportant one in the greater scheme of things at that, makes you seem downright petulant and whinging. (Not saying you necessarily are, just that that is how it comes across.) Why not just accept that you are wrong, but that you would *prefer* it your way? That I could understand - we all have different preferences sometimes. But it's not always feasible or even proper to cater to every preference, especially when it does not concern actual function.

As for the order of icons in the shelf, unless you are talking about one of the special tabs like Folder Tab or a Virtual Folder Tab, icons can be arranged in any way you like (it's always been so from the start), alphabetically, reverse alphabetically, or even completely in random order.

So for the shelf of your preference, you could quite simply arrange your icons so that the rows effectively are in reverse order, using 'invisible' (i.e., fully transparent 'mock') icons - without a label - to fill up what in effect will be the last row, if it normally is not a full row. Works like a charm, I've tried it.

And no, this issue has absolutely zero to do with customisation. It is, as also Jorge has pointed out from the beginning, purely a matter of preference. So please don't presume to tell Jorge what Winstep is all about. Nobody would know better what Winstep is all about than the man who codes it. To put in an option for such a preference that would require quite a lot of work, for a relatively small number of users and one that would no doubt be very confusing to new users at least, cannot be justifiable in my book. There are far more important things to be dealt with than be side-tracked into this. My vote would definitely be against it.

_________________
nexter - so, what's next?


Back to top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Icon Row order for Shelves at the top of the screen
PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2018 3:30 pm 
Offline
Site Admin
User avatar

Joined: Thu Feb 26, 2004 8:30 pm
Posts: 9407
Ok, as I said above any further discussion on this topic would not be productive at all since we would only be discussing personal preferences.

As such, I am going to lock the topic so people here don't start getting upset with each other over *personal preferences*.

I will also see what I can do for next release regarding this subject.

_________________
Jorge Coelho
Winstep Xtreme - Xtreme Power!
http://www.winstep.net - Winstep Software Technologies


Back to top
 Profile WWW 
 
Post new topic This topic is locked, you cannot edit posts or make further replies. Board index : Winstep Forums : General Discussion  [ 40 posts ] Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 17 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to: