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 Post subject: Re: Apropos "Abandonware", ETC.
PostPosted: Mon Aug 03, 2020 9:42 pm 
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I'll add the site to my daily rotation of links (sites I visit at least once a day). Of the primary reasons I've been reticent to discuss this here is, well, let me give you an example:

About 30 years ago, I used to sell Commodore Amiga computers at a computer store that only sold Amiga. This was in Phoenix, Arizona.

Before I tell the rest of this, I think of the owner as a sniveling snot of a man. I worked for him and while I'm a short guy and was younger than him by about 10 years, I looked down on him in every way possible except physically. He was whiney, emotional, cruel, and mean-tempered. During the short time I worked for him, his wife of 10 or so years left him and their two kids to live with her frog lover.

My second day there, a customer called me from Tucson (next largest city in Arizona, about 1.5 hours from our store) and introduced himself as a long-time customer of Henry's and stating he knows how Henry works. He assured me I would get the sale (we salespeople were base salary plus a commission) of a new Amiga system if I would go check out a certain model in back, make sure the box was not a return, and mark it as reserved. When he got there a few hours later, he identified himself to me, I got the computer, rang it up and sold it to the guy. We walked out to the car together and he explained that he'd been witness to Henry receiving a returned computer, cleaning it up in the front of the store in front of other customers, and then selling it as new to an unsuspecting customer a couple of hours later.

Well, that was disappointing. I later went to work for a competing store with a much cooler boss.

But, one of the most reprehensible acts I saw in Henry's store was not by him, but against him. Atari ST users often saw Amiga users as "the enemy." And any store that sold only Amigas was fair game. So, they would come in and cause dissension by discussing their favorite computer, often starting arguments and occasionally stealing a say from us. I don't recall there being an Atari ST store like the two (later three) Amiga stores. You usually bought those at a big box store.

It got Henry (and us salespeople) so upset. This was affecting my paycheck.

Now, I know Jorge's now-frequent and now-long absences are not helping. We know a previous lapse was due to a personal relationship ending and that's understandable. However, it would not be difficult for Jorge to get on and make a quick announcement saying he needed a break.

But, I detest the idea that we are discussing a replacement and, potentially, a competing product on his forums. I consider this (from the very beginning) to have been spam because of which forum it's in and it has always made me uncomfortable to talk about it here. It seems very uncouth to me.

For me, this particular topic is finished. I won't participate in a discussion here on Jorge's site unless he sanctions it. Also, this should always have been started in Off-topic, not here.

I refuse to be like those Atari ST users that I grew to (mostly) despise.


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 Post subject: Re: Apropos "Abandonware", ETC.
PostPosted: Tue Aug 04, 2020 2:01 am 
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To a certain degree I alas have to agree with you, DD_Ric. Yes, this thread belongs in 'Off Topic', no argument. I did say so after the first couple of posts. (But of course Jorge being AWOL it stayed here. Of course, the whole thing began with regard to the possibility that one day - not necessarily all that far in the future - Jorge might need/want a replacement for Winstep. (See the initial post.) And the discussion quickly took on a life of its own. Competing product, not really - a), we really would like Jorge onboard to do a Windows version if it suits him, and b), we're really essentially talking about a very different Linux product, albeit with a Windows etc. version in the not so near future if possible.

However, I strongly disagree with your Atari-Users-in-Amiga-Store analogy. It simply does not fit. Especially given that we're all very dedicated Winstep users and that I myself have been with the project since the beginning.

And by the by, sure, some Atari users were pretty loutish, but we can't tar them all with that brush. E.G. I knew several Atari users who used it purely for the midi and the music apps, but used other hardware for everything else, including Amigas.

Anyway, ideally we should continue the discussion on the new forum - we can always add a summary of what's gone before afterwards or link here for the time being - ideally, if Steve is ready, or at least continue in 'Off Topic' - suggested subject header for that 'A New GUI' perhaps?

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 Post subject: Re: Apropos "Abandonware", ETC.
PostPosted: Tue Aug 04, 2020 7:56 am 
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nexter wrote:
To a certain degree I alas have to agree with you, DD_Ric. Yes, this thread belongs in 'Off Topic', no argument.


Anyway, ideally we should continue the discussion on the new forum - we can always add a summary of what's gone before afterwards or link here for the time being - ideally, if Steve is ready, or at least continue in 'Off Topic' - suggested subject header for that 'A New GUI' perhaps?

I have to agree with the summery that this belongs in off topic, you go on to mention N_Ric/Nexter moving manualy to off topic. Why not to the new forums, I just went and uptadted a new domain/vps hosting/ and are in the process off installing wordpress and phpBB forums(all off our own). This did not come FREE so I have receipts pending as it where, should we go down some funded route.


DesertDwarf wrote:
However, it would not be difficult for Jorge to get on and make a quick announcement saying he needed a break.

Anyway adding to it, we have practical begged Jorge to get involved. We are not DesertDwarf going out in competition to him, far from it we wish him to get involved and for him even to benefit financially to. I is not to long ago that I shelled out and upgraded my Winstep license.

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 Post subject: Re: Apropos "Abandonware", ETC.
PostPosted: Tue Aug 04, 2020 6:47 pm 
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oOSGearOo wrote:
nexter wrote:
To a certain degree I alas have to agree with you, DD_Ric. Yes, this thread belongs in 'Off Topic', no argument.

Anyway, ideally we should continue the discussion on the new forum - we can always add a summary of what's gone before afterwards or link here for the time being - ideally, if Steve is ready, or at least continue in 'Off Topic' - suggested subject header for that 'A New GUI' perhaps?

I have to agree with the summery that this belongs in off topic, you go on to mention N_Ric/Nexter moving manualy to off topic. Why not to the new forums, I just went and uptadted a new domain/vps hosting/ and are in the process off installing wordpress and phpBB forums(all off our own). This did not come FREE so I have receipts pending as it where, should we go down some funded route.

Well that's what I said - ideally and if you're ready let's continue in your new forum/s. :) Just checked the site a while ago but nothing there yet... Oh, and do keep a record of what you spend, for as and when we go funding. (Alas, it's still way too early for that of course.)

Meanwhile, I've looked at some of my digital art for suitable potential backgrounds/'wallpapers' for making a rough mock-up preview of what I have in mind for 'Phase 1' - the simple DE, and I've pretty much decided on one. Sadly, still can't get to work on it so far, but at least it's a start.

And here are a couple of 'Working Title' suggestions for the project -

Project Workspace (as our DE will use something that's not really a simple desktop but rather what the title suggests, and even more so the second phase, the 3-D version)
Project Genesis 20 (a variation of which is the title of the whole thing, OS and all that)
Project Magic Workplace

oOSGearOo wrote:
DesertDwarf wrote:
However, it would not be difficult for Jorge to get on and make a quick announcement saying he needed a break.

Anyway adding to it, we have practical begged Jorge to get involved. We are not DesertDwarf going out in competition to him, far from it we wish him to get involved and for him even to benefit financially to. I is not to long ago that I shelled out and upgraded my Winstep license.

Absolutely agree Steve. But of course as Jorge seems to be AWOL again he's unlikely to have seen any of it yet.

In the meantime, have another look at my previous post (or maybe two or so back?) re: details for possible temporary logo for your site. You can always PM details to me.

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 Post subject: Re: Apropos "Abandonware", ETC.
PostPosted: Wed Aug 05, 2020 8:04 pm 
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Joined: Fri Sep 14, 2018 6:42 pm
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nexter wrote:
Absolutely agree Steve. But of course as Jorge seems to be AWOL again he's unlikely to have seen any of it yet.

In the meantime, have another look at my previous post (or maybe two or so back?) re: details for possible temporary logo for your site. You can always PM details to me.

Its been a few days, err you have pm's Nexter

We are up with the new home, Nexter can you try and join the phpBB forum, plz.
Ile (step/set you up) you up after you join.

Anyone is welcome please be aware that this is still under development both the website and the forum. If you would like in on the topic apply within as they say send me a pm or post here. these are the first baby steps. It should help us not spam Jorge;s forum.

Calling all members be in on the ground floor at the experimental forum/website/project

JORGE we would love to have you onboard.
DesertDwarf just send me a pm and your in.

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 Post subject: Re: Apropos "Abandonware", ETC.
PostPosted: Thu Aug 06, 2020 2:35 am 
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oOSGearOo wrote:
nexter wrote:
Absolutely agree Steve. But of course as Jorge seems to be AWOL again he's unlikely to have seen any of it yet.

In the meantime, have another look at my previous post (or maybe two or so back?) re: details for possible temporary logo for your site. You can always PM details to me.

Its been a few days, err you have pm's Nexter

Will check in a bit - need a short break after this.
oOSGearOo wrote:
We are up with the new home, Nexter can you try and join the phpBB forum, plz.
Ile (step/set you up) you up after you join.

May have to do that later in the day.
oOSGearOo wrote:
Anyone is welcome please be aware that this is still under development both the website and the forum. If you would like in on the topic apply within as they say send me a pm or post here. these are the first baby steps. It should help us not spam Jorge;s forum.

Calling all members be in on the ground floor at the experimental forum/website/project

JORGE we would love to have you onboard.
DesertDwarf just send me a pm and your in.


All seconded. :)

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 Post subject: Re: Apropos "Abandonware", ETC.
PostPosted: Fri Aug 07, 2020 3:50 pm 
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OK, as the new dedicated forum is more or less in place now, I'll copy out this entire thread (might take me a few days) to edit into a summary perhaps for the new forum. Once that's done I'll post here again to close this thread and to give the new forum url for those who might be interested to follow/take part in the discussion.

Perhaps you could move this thread to "Off Topic" when you get a chance Jorge? MTIA.

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 Post subject: Re: Apropos "Abandonware", ETC.
PostPosted: Fri Aug 07, 2020 4:35 pm 
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Joined: Fri Sep 14, 2018 6:42 pm
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Hi
Many thanks to all involved this is the start off something hopefully we will gain more momentum and make some real progress. I appeal to all who maybe just want to read or perhaps do more. send nexter, DesertDwarf, or me a pm and we will hook you up in the new form. thanks again and ile leave the final words to nexter via the quote below.



nexter wrote:
OK, as the new dedicated forum is more or less in place now, I'll copy out this entire thread (might take me a few days) to edit into a summary perhaps for the new forum. Once that's done I'll post here again to close this thread and to give the new forum url for those who might be interested to follow/take part in the discussion.

Perhaps you could move this thread to "Off Topic" when you get a chance Jorge? MTIA.

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 Post subject: Re: Apropos "Abandonware", ETC.
PostPosted: Fri Aug 07, 2020 9:58 pm 
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nexter wrote:
Perhaps you could move this thread to "Off Topic" when you get a chance Jorge? MTIA.


Done! :)

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 Post subject: Re: Apropos "Abandonware", ETC.
PostPosted: Sat Aug 08, 2020 4:49 am 
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winstep wrote:
nexter wrote:
Perhaps you could move this thread to "Off Topic" when you get a chance Jorge? MTIA.

Done! :)

Thanks Jorge. Sorry it started off in the wrong place really in the first place. Had no idea it would become the monster it has! ;)

Busy copying this thread to edit it into a summary for the new forum, where you'd be most welcome BTW.

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 Post subject: Re: Apropos "Abandonware", ETC.
PostPosted: Fri Aug 21, 2020 7:46 pm 
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This thread is now closed and dead - for any further developments see the post "Follow-on to 'Apropos Abandonware ETC'" in this forum.

Jorge, if you're seeing this, could you please delete this thread altogether in a day or two, it really has become an irrelevance here being in the end really focused on Linux and so it has no place here. I censor myself! ;) Besides, folks can always find us in our new home. I've copied the thread and there'll be a summary of it there soon.

A big thank you again Jorge for your great tolerance and kindness.

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 Post subject: Re: Apropos "Abandonware", ETC.
PostPosted: Fri Aug 21, 2020 8:58 pm 
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Is the ability to reply or create messages disabled? I couldnt seem to mange it, I am talking about your new site of course....


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 Post subject: Re: Apropos "Abandonware", ETC.
PostPosted: Sat Aug 22, 2020 2:18 pm 
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AlanWade wrote:
Is the ability to reply or create messages disabled? I couldnt seem to mange it, I am talking about your new site of course....

Please see the topic 'Follow on to "Apropos Abandonware" for my reply as this thread is meant to be closed and deleted. :)

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 Post subject: Re: Apropos "Abandonware", ETC.
PostPosted: Sat Aug 22, 2020 2:37 pm 
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Please DO NOT post further in this topic as it is due for deletion. Use Follow-on to "Apropos Abandonware ETC" https://forums.winstep.net/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=11424 instead. Thank you.

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 Post subject: Re: Apropos "Abandonware", ETC.
PostPosted: Sat Aug 22, 2020 5:26 pm 
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I don't like deleting threads (unless they are 100% spam bot threads). I can lock this thread so nobody else can post though, would that be ok?

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