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 Post subject: Re: So, what's next after v17.12?
PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2018 2:54 am 
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Windy wrote:
Can you add a lock feature to sub-docks and to drawers when you implement it to prevent them from disappearing when something is clicked? I can't drag something from the Start Menu to the sub-dock. This would make things much easier.


winstep wrote:
You're doing it backwards.

You're first opening the sub-dock and then the Start Menu, which, obviously, immediately closes the sub-dock as soon as you click on the Start Button.

What you need to do is open the Start Menu first. Then drag the item you want OVER the sub-dock's parent icon in the main dock, and let it hover for just a little bit. Just like the method described in my previous post, the sub-dock will automatically open after a very short while.

NOW you can drop your shortcut into it.

You can do the same with the Shelf, even a collapsed one: drag a shortcut over a Shelf tab and the Shelf will automatically expand *and* select the tab you are hovering over. With the Shelf open, you can drag the shortcut over other tab headers to automatically select those tabs until you find the one you want.

Likewise, if a Shelf tab has more icon rows than those that are visible, you can access the hidden rows by dragging the shortcut over the little scroll arrows at the right of the Shelf body: the Shelf will automatically scroll up or down.



For others that might not be aware as you mentioned in a earlier post, press Ctrl while dropping if you want the file or shortcut to COPY and not move. Again, you've come to the rescue! Thanks again Jorge! :D


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 Post subject: Re: So, what's next after v17.12?
PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2018 8:28 am 
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Its a bit late and yku decided on a solution already ut seems but i eas traveling back home ftom usa and couldnt poat before, here is what i wrote while offline :
Maybe make one genneral setting:
A nimatios during full screen app on other monitor:
On/(partial) /off
And maybe a setting in each module to respect global settings or not


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 Post subject: Re: So, what's next after v17.12?
PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2018 11:04 am 
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seeker wrote:
Its a bit late and yku decided on a solution already ut seems but i eas traveling back home ftom usa and couldnt poat before, here is what i wrote while offline : Maybe make one genneral setting: A nimatios during full screen app on other monitor:


LOL. Guess this is what you would sound like with marbles in your mouth. :wink:

Anyway, welcome back!

Something I would like to revisit which I'm afraid got a bit lost in all the clutter of the previous page (and please bear with my ramblings since I'm brainstorming at the same time): :)

winstep wrote:
NextSTART hotspots opening WorkShelf sub-docks. Buttons in the Quick Launch section of the NextSTART taskbar are hotspots, so that would be a handy way to activate/open a sub-dock.


The major problem with this, given that the hotspot buttons would be in NextSTART but the actual sub-docks in WorkShelf, is twofold:

1. How to uniquely identify sub-docks so NextSTART can tell WorkShelf which sub-dock to open with that hotspot. This can be solved by making better usage of something that isn't even very apparent at the moment: each dock/sub-dock can *already* have a *unique* name (in the Dock & Shelves tab in Preferences, the actual name appears after the word 'Dock - '. Of course, the default name is 'Nexus', so they are all named the same).

Because this feature was never put into practical use, currently the only way to rename a dock is by renaming the dock control icon. This can be changed in the future, of course.

Anyway, this would only be a problem if the sub-docks used by NextSTART hotspots had to be created first in WorkShelf, so the hotspot could then select from a list of available pre-created sub-docks. But that is not what will happen.

2. A simple question of sub-dock management.

Under WorkShelf/Nexus Ultimate you manage sub-docks via the sub-dock parent icon. To remove/delete a sub-dock, you delete the sub-dock parent icon, which also deletes the sub-dock. To access settings for a sub-dock, you do so via the right-click context menu of the sub-dock parent icon.

Note also that sub-docks do NOT appear in the Docks & Shelves tab in Preferences.

So, the most logical and consistent approach to using sub-docks associated to NextSTART hotspots would be to create an empty sub-dock in WorkShelf when you create a hotspot button associated to a sub-dock in NextSTART (or rather, only *actually* create it once the user adds something to it). Each sub-dock would also have unique identifiers created by the applications themselves, so which sub-dock is associated to which hotspot is known.

This is possible because NextSTART and WorkShelf communicate with each other. NextSTART can thus tell WorkShelf: hey, open sub-dock <ThisID> at the mouse position right now.

In much the same way, deleting a NextSTART hotspot associated to a sub-dock would make NextSTART send a message to WorkShelf saying 'delete sub-dock <ThisId>'.

The problem here is that NextSTART is a separate application from WorkShelf so internal consistency can be difficult.

A possible scenario goes like this: the user creates a new sub-dock by adding a hotspot in NextSTART associated to a sub-dock and adds some stuff to it. Now, remember, the hotspot exists in NextSTART, but the actual sub-dock and its contents exists only in WorkShelf.

Now imagine you restore an old backup of NextSTART settings, one where the sub-dock hotspot does not exist. Since this hotspot no longer exists in NextSTART, you can no longer use it to delete the sub-dock in WorkShelf. So, potentially, the sub-dock would remain orphaned forever in WorkShelf, not accessible from anywhere but contributing to internal clutter.

The opposite is also possible of course (restoring a WorkShelf backup which erases the contents of your NextSTART sub-dock) but possibly less serious because it has no 'hidden' pitfalls, other than you having to reconstruct the sub-dock from scratch.

Hmmmm... *OR* I make WorkShelf store (and retrieve) NextSTART sub-docks from the NextSTART settings area, so they go together with NextSTART backups.

Guess that would work. :)


And finally: just as a little cool touch, been experimenting with making the tabs in Preferences slide-in instead of simply popping up (e.g.; you're in the About tab and click the tab before it, the new tab slides in from the left horizontally at the same time the About tab slides out to the right).

I got it working and it kind of looks cool, but I'm not sure if it's better. Apparently it can trigger motion sickness lol

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 Post subject: Re: So, what's next after v17.12?
PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2018 3:21 pm 
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Joined: Tue Mar 01, 2016 11:46 am
Posts: 269
winstep wrote:
seeker wrote:
Its a bit late and yku decided on a solution already ut seems but i eas traveling back home ftom usa and couldnt poat before, here is what i wrote while offline : Maybe make one genneral setting: A nimatios during full screen app on other monitor:


LOL. Guess this is what you would sound like with marbles in your mouth. :wink:

or when typing on android half asleep :)


winstep wrote:
Note also that sub-docks do NOT appear in the Docks & Shelves tab in Preferences.

maybe make a tab for them or include them in docks & shelves tab?
it would be handy to have an overview of all subdocks in one place
(maybe with a note which shelf tab/dock sub dock is attached to?

winstep wrote:
Hmmmm... *OR* I make WorkShelf store (and retrieve) NextSTART sub-docks from the NextSTART settings area, so they go together with NextSTART backups.

implementing hotspot functionality into workshelf app itself would be to complicated?


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 Post subject: Re: So, what's next after v17.12?
PostPosted: Fri Jan 12, 2018 3:45 am 
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seeker wrote:
implementing hotspot functionality into workshelf app itself would be to complicated?


Eh? Why would you want to do that if NextSTART already covers that for you?

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 Post subject: Re: So, what's next after v17.12?
PostPosted: Fri Jan 12, 2018 11:27 am 
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winstep wrote:
seeker wrote:
implementing hotspot functionality into workshelf app itself would be to complicated?


Eh? Why would you want to do that if NextSTART already covers that for you?

dont know how many people use just one and not the other, i only use workshelf and dont run nextstart at all for example


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 Post subject: Re: So, what's next after v17.12?
PostPosted: Fri Jan 12, 2018 11:53 am 
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seeker wrote:
dont know how many people use just one and not the other, i only use workshelf and dont run nextstart at all for example


NextSTART is modular. You can disable the taskbar replacement, etc, and use only the hotspots, pre-defined menus, etc...

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 Post subject: Re: So, what's next after v17.12?
PostPosted: Fri Jan 12, 2018 4:15 pm 
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i actually disabled nextstart because of startup speed back when i didnt have ssd


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 Post subject: Re: So, what's next after v17.12?
PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 10:43 am 
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seeker wrote:
i actually disabled nextstart because of startup speed back when i didnt have ssd


Tsk tsk... NextSTART is a lot lighter on Startup than WorkShelf. Well, now you have a SSD. No excuses. :)

In the mean time, I have been making a lot of cosmetic changes to the UI (and finding and fixing some new bugs). I can't do any deep changes that would take me a long time to implement properly mostly because the drag & drop file copy/move operation bug (the comma in the filename) in v17.12 is pretty serious if you are affected by it, so it needs a new version out that fixes it ASAP.

At the same time, I wanted the new version to also have something new to play with, so I resumed working on my User Interface Dark Theme idea to match the Windows 10 Dark Theme mode. I really don't like the way Microsoft failed - deliberately, I think - to match the UI of Win32 applications with the overall look of Windows 10.

There are two extra modes, a black and a dark gray one. The result is, I think, not too bad (but please let me know your TRUE opinion), although there might still be room for improvement (if I decide to make buttons and combo boxes user-drawn, instead of using the standard Microsoft Common Controls Win32 look):

Image

Image

Image

I also implemented a new tab switch slide effect as I mentioned previously, and although the effect itself is kind of cool (and I've also seen it on Linux, for instance) I'm not sure if I like it better than the instantaneous tab switch. Either way, it's optional (see new 'Disable User Interface Animation' setting in the first image) so it can be turned off - the real question is whether it should be the new default or not.

I know a static image does not make it justice, but to at least give you an idea what I am talking about, this is what would happen when going from the General tab in Preferences to the Modules tab (of course, the slide animation is pretty quick, at about 600 ms):

Image

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 Post subject: Re: So, what's next after v17.12?
PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 11:53 am 
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winstep wrote:
NextSTART is modular. You can disable the taskbar replacement, etc, and use only the hotspots, pre-defined menus, etc...


Oh, that's nice, didn't know this at all.
But how do I access the settings of NextStart now that I have disabled the taskbar replacement?
If it has a tray icon that can be disabled in the settings, I probably have disabled it...
Can't seem to find any way to access the settings anymore.


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 Post subject: Re: So, what's next after v17.12?
PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 12:09 pm 
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You can always press CTRL+F12.

There is another way, which is to double-click the titlebar of a NextSTART menu. Some menus don't have a titlebar, so you must double-click the top edge of the menu.

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 Post subject: Re: So, what's next after v17.12?
PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 12:41 pm 
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winstep wrote:
You can always press CTRL+F12.

There is another way, which is to double-click the titlebar of a NextSTART menu. Some menus don't have a titlebar, so you must double-click the top edge of the menu.


Thanks.


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 Post subject: Re: So, what's next after v17.12?
PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 12:57 pm 
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Regarding 'bugs' fixed, something else I forgot to mention above, something that isn't even a bug by itself.

A few releases back I implemented the 'Language Bar' internal command. Although meaningless to most users, this was a fundamental requirement to users who need to switch between language inputs or keyboard layouts. Upon first run, if NextSTART detected multiple input methods were present it would automatically add a 'Language Bar' button/IC the the Quick Launch section of the NextSTART taskbar.

This is another one of those features I worked on for a while, thoroughly tested to make sure it was working correctly, and then forgot all about since I don't even use it myself.

This Language Bar IC is (still) working correctly under Windows 7 - but I just found out it does nothing under Windows 10. Once again, at some point, Microsoft changed something in Windows 10 which broke something that was previously working fine.

I vaguely remember one user pointing out some time ago that there was a problem with the IC, but I was too busy at the time to look into it and the heads up ended up slipping my mind.

I managed to fix it (apparently input method changes are now system wide on Windows 10, while on Windows 7 they would be on a window-by-window case) but this shows how exasperating Microsoft's current RAD (Rapid Application Development) model in Windows 10 can be for developers. It keeps breaking stuff that was previously working fine and it's unrealistic to expect developers to re-test every single little feature, which was previously working fine, every time Microsoft releases a Windows update or lets out a fart (pardon my French).

Again, had it not been for me vaguely remembering that user's warning, it might not even have occurred to me to re-test the Language Bar feature in Windows 10. Also proves how important it is for users to report in about stuff that is broken or not working as it should.

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 Post subject: Re: So, what's next after v17.12?
PostPosted: Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:48 am 
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winstep wrote:
At the same time, I wanted the new version to also have something new to play with, so I resumed working on my User Interface Dark Theme idea to match the Windows 10 Dark Theme mode. I really don't like the way Microsoft failed - deliberately, I think - to match the UI of Win32 applications with the overall look of Windows 10.

There are two extra modes, a black and a dark gray one. The result is, I think, not too bad (but please let me know your TRUE opinion), although there might still be room for improvement (if I decide to make buttons and combo boxes user-drawn, instead of using the standard Microsoft Common Controls Win32 look):

Jorge, from the screenshots, it looks good. And I'm sure you're right: MS wanted Win32 apps to look "out of place" in their shiny new (HEH!) 64-bit OS.
winstep wrote:
I also implemented a new tab switch slide effect as I mentioned previously, and although the effect itself is kind of cool (and I've also seen it on Linux, for instance) I'm not sure if I like it better than the instantaneous tab switch. Either way, it's optional (see new 'Disable User Interface Animation' setting in the first image) so it can be turned off - the real question is whether it should be the new default or not.

I know a static image does not make it justice, but to at least give you an idea what I am talking about, this is what would happen when going from the General tab in Preferences to the Modules tab (of course, the slide animation is pretty quick, at about 600 ms):

Sometimes a GIF is worth a thousand words . . . ;-)

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 Post subject: Re: So, what's next after v17.12?
PostPosted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 2:11 am 
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seeker wrote:
i actually disabled nextstart because of startup speed back when i didnt have ssd


Just to let you know I fixed that animation issue with the Cabal Email Checker in the Modules tab. It wasn't forgotten.

It's not as it should be (both styles currently assume the same customized animation) but for now it will do.

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